How to advise my friend | ExpatWoman.com
 

How to advise my friend

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EW EXPLORER
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 14:44

A good friend of mine is married to a divorcee. The hsbd has 2 kids with his ex. When they got married, the ex said so many things that hurt my friend's feeling that she couldn't get over it despite enjoying a good marriage with her hsbd.

She just told me that her hsbd ex has decided to jump start her career which require her to go to training which might take several years. In order to do that, the hsbd has to take care of their 18 y.o. son who has asperger. My friend completely refuses to do that after all the things that the ex had said about her over the years and also because she might end up being treated like a maid by the son. Apparently, the ex doesn't make the children lift a finger all their life.

Anyway, she has given her hsbd an ultimatum. She would only allow the son to come and stay with them once in a while and not for a long term. She told him that if he allows the son to move in with them, she want a divorce and it's not negotiable. She told me he is a wonderful hsbd.

I have given her my understanding and also my advice. I told her to forget the ex and just think of her hsbd. I can't imagine how the hsbd feel having to choose between his wife and his son.
<em>edited by blimey on 15/02/2011</em>

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EW EXPERT
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 14:52
If you offer advice if may end up biting you on the bottom as oft happens with sensitive family issues. I would listen to her, eat chocolate with her, drink cyber wine with her but I [i'>would not[/i'> offer any advice. The matter is life changing either way and she needs to take full responsibility for the decision she makes.
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EW EXPLORER
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 14:24
kcinthecity: yeah, I hope that's the case....just venting her frustration but knowing how she feels about the ex all these years, I couldn't help but feel very wary and concern about the ultimatum she said she has given her hsbd. She is a good friend but can be very unpredictable at times. BMAP: From what I understand, her hsbd is paying 1K a month to the son until he turns 23. She mentioned that the son also receive benefit from govt. Not sure about the alimony support for the ex though. Could be the reason for the ex seeking to jump start her career at this point of time. The other kid is already 21 and working.
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EW NEWBIE
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 13:35
A diff point of view: Your friend was venting to you.... when I vent sometimes I get seriously overdramatic and everything is a HUGE deal and I always say I am going to do extreme things. Maybe your friend just needed to get her basest thoughts and feelings out and felt comfy enough to do that with you. I seriously hate venting to DH because he gets all sanctimonious on me and starts giving me advice. I am a pretty reasonable person, dont make hasty decisions and am not unduly harsh. But it does not sound like it when I vent. Give her some time to adjust. Life as she was expecting it to be is going to change dramatically. It takes time getting used to. I would email her and tell her that you understand what she is going through with regard to changes in her life, but this is his son and that she should calm down and speak with her husband before throwing around the leaving him card, but you are here is she needs to talk about anything and then I would leave it at that. Now here is my assumption, you seem like a reasonable person and a nice concerned friend. Your friend probably is similar (you are both friends after all), she probably just needs time to accept and process this curveball being thrown at her.
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EW GURU
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 12:27
[i'>Quote: "Agreed. poor boy........but I'm surprised that no one has questioned the actions (or motivations) of the boy's mother. She is, in effect abandoning her vulnerable son.... after 18 years in order to "kickstart her career". But, whatever she intended, she has probably well and truly stuffed OP's friend's marriage." [/i'> I think that might be a little unfair. I'm not quite up on the legislation relating to the support of minors in this situation in Australia, but from interactions with other parents in similar situations I can hazard a guess... The fact of the matter is probably more likely that the mother has been this boy's primary carer for the last 18 years. The Australian government has probably given her some degree of financial and possibly even physical (via respite) support to do this. She has probably been out of the workforce for 18 years becasue she was his primary carer. Further, her ex DH has probably also been paying child support all that time too and that has kept them both afloat. Now the boy is 18 and classed as an adult, she may not receive the DH's child support any more. She may also not receive an allowance from the government as the child is not considered her dependent. She may have been forced into a situation where she has to reskill in order to enter the workforce simply so she can live above the poverty line into her old age. It is not an ideal situation where her Aspie boy is concerned. But the exwife may not have a choice... Edited to highlight quote <em>edited by Buy me a Pony on 16/02/2011</em>
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EW OLDHAND
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 11:01
Hi Blimey - what about hiring a helper for the boy? I can't imagine how difficult it would be take on someone else's children, especially if they have Auspergers, I think if your friend positioned it that way with her husband it would be a win-win situation for everyone. Radical, even doing something like hiring a helper for the lad will still mean dad and step mum putting in hours a day on him, and even then you just couldnt bring anyone to help. The person would have to know what they were doing and it costs a fortune, but more importantly the dad and step mum would also have to be well on top of the Aspergers in order to make sure that what needs to be done is done. This isn't something you can just do, you have to want to do it, you have to feel it in your heart and your soul. I don't think the new wife will ever feel it, and I'm not that sure about the dad either given how he went on to a new life without this scenario ever being brought up. Even given the age the lad is he should be making the transition to a young mans life, he needs to be in well supported family or assisted living environment where the people are dedicated to helping him fulfull his potential in a very difficult world. He should be with a devoted parent/parents, and/or professionals who are doing what they are doing because they love it and only have the best will in the world for the people they are helping. He deserves way more than a family environment where he is barely if at all tolerated by at least one of those around him. Someone said no-one was questioning the mothers motives. I am but I dont have her down as a deliberate marriage wrecker. I have her down as a woman who's brought up her son single-handedly and who for a whole host of reasons might have lost sight of reality for a wee while. And lets face it what kind of marriage does the dad and the new step mum have if it can be sunk by even the mention of the boy perhaps coming to live with them?
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EW EXPLORER
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 10:31
Okay. I have chosen the coward way and sent her an email. I figured....she would at least read it and hopefully, reconsider and try to look at the issue in a different perspective. Wish me luck ladies. Hopefully, I still have a friend at the end of the day ;)
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EW MASTER
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 09:48
Agreed. poor boy........but I'm surprised that no one has questioned the actions (or motivations) of the boy's mother. She is, in effect abandoning her vulnerable son.... after 18 years in order to "kickstart her career". But, whatever she intended, she has probably well and truly stuffed OP's friend's marriage. Good point, LT. Thing is, if she feels that she has been caring for their child almost single-handedly for the past 18 years, I can understand why she may think, OK, he's reached majority, I've had my life on hold all these years, my turn now. I shouldn't think she's abandoning him as such, I would hope that is OP's friend's slant on it, as the ex and her ex husband should by now be able to discuss their children reasonably and responsibly rather than the ex issuing such an ultimatum out of the blue.
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EW NEWBIE
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 09:47
Hi Blimey - what about hiring a helper for the boy? I can't imagine how difficult it would be take on someone else's children, especially if they have Auspergers, I think if your friend positioned it that way with her husband it would be a win-win situation for everyone.
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EW MASTER
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 09:42
Hi, Blimey! I've kept out of this so far as I had nothing positive to contribute, but I just wanted to say that this lady is lucky to have a friend such as you. Also, if she was just venting, maybe she has rethought her position already? Leaving aside the questions of the ex and the poor son, perhaps you could just ask her how she thinks she would feel if she left her husband and was on her own again after 3 years of happiness? I think you said it took her a long time to find him. Would she prefer to be single again?
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EW OLDHAND
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 09:35
Thank you very much ladies. I feel now I have a clearer approach to advise my friend on this matter without appearing that I am taking the ex's side. Yeah...her resentment toward the ex has obviously clouded her judgement and most importantly her feeling toward her hsbd. I hope I could get through to her before it's too late. If you want to maintain a friendship with her, perhaps you should just say "I'm sorry, I can't get involved on this one"... Unless of course she accepts that you disagree with her.... I'm with DRose on this one, I really feel for this boy. He does not deserve this... Agreed. poor boy........but I'm surprised that no one has questioned the actions (or motivations) of the boy's mother. She is, in effect abandoning her vulnerable son.... after 18 years in order to "kickstart her career". But, whatever she intended, she has probably well and truly stuffed OP's friend's marriage.
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EW EXPLORER
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 09:33
Thank you very much ladies. I feel now I have a clearer approach to advise my friend on this matter without appearing that I am taking the ex's side. Yeah...her resentment toward the ex has obviously clouded her judgement and most importantly her feeling toward her hsbd. I hope I could get through to her before it's too late. If you want to maintain a friendship with her, perhaps you should just say "I'm sorry, I can't get involved on this one"... Unless of course she accepts that you disagree with her.... I'm with DRose on this one, I really feel for this boy. He does not deserve this... You are right of course, I could just ignore the issue. She just wanted me to listen to her venting. But we are friends! How could I just let my friend commit a big mistake in her life without at least trying to make her see beyond her resentment toward the ex. If she want to throw away our friendship as well......well, I guess I have to be prepared for it. Sad as it is.
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EW NEWBIE
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 09:26
Thank you very much ladies. I feel now I have a clearer approach to advise my friend on this matter without appearing that I am taking the ex's side. Yeah...her resentment toward the ex has obviously clouded her judgement and most importantly her feeling toward her hsbd. I hope I could get through to her before it's too late. If you want to maintain a friendship with her, perhaps you should just say "I'm sorry, I can't get involved on this one"... Unless of course she accepts that you disagree with her.... I'm with DRose on this one, I really feel for this boy. He does not deserve this...
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EW NEWBIE
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 09:10
Ask her what she would feel if he turned his back when their own child is in need.. (I guess they don't have one) She should be happy that she is married to that nice man who doesn't turn his back on his children for the woman in his life.
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EW EXPLORER
Latest post on 16 February 2011 - 07:58
Thank you very much ladies. I feel now I have a clearer approach to advise my friend on this matter without appearing that I am taking the ex's side. Yeah...her resentment toward the ex has obviously clouded her judgement and most importantly her feeling toward her hsbd. I hope I could get through to her before it's too late.
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EW OLDHAND
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 19:26
As hard as it must be for your friend to accept the idea of a child joining the family, and at the request of someone she doesn't like very much, her actions here will cause untold resentment from all sides. Her husband will view her as someone who made him choose between her and his son - I don't know any man who's respect for someone wouldn't be diminished by this. The ex will have the moral high ground, and rightfully so. The son...the poor boy. Can you imagine how he would feel? I can, having been through the same experience, only without the added difficulty of being on the autistic spectrum. He will feel rejected - utterly rejected - by one of the two people who are supposed to love him most in the world and he will, of course, blame your friend. With regards to the son't potential poor treatment of your friend - I suggest she sits down with her husband and implements a strict set of rules. They need to get on the same wavelength and she needs her husband's support in not being treated like a doormat (as she assumes will happen). I understand that the history with the ex is painful, I do...but she must realise that she is only hurting this boy, and that is not fair at all. She is also letting the ex 'win' so to speak. Gosh I hope they sort it out - she stands to lose a lot if she forces this 'choosing' thing.
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EW EXPLORER
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 19:10
Yes she is being terribly unfair - just because when she married her husband, his son's "custody" arrangement was that he lived with the Mum - but why shouldn't the Dad take responsibility for "custody" at some point. And that sort of ultimatum is so childish........ Having said that, I have a number of friends who are married to divorcees with children from previous marriages and it seems in their situation, the husbands or Dads let the children run rough-shod over the new wife - don't set boundaries etc. So my constructive advice is she needs to apologize to her DH, educate herself on her step-sons capabilities and where he needs help, discuss with her DH where she will need help with him, and set ground rules, or house rules ...that both her and her DH can agree on and establish together. She needs to get over the ex's comments to her, she is allowing her to meddle in her relationship, exactly what the ex wants....she should go to counselling if need be, but she needs to be a grown up and get past this.
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EW OLDHAND
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 18:05
So many wonderful and spot on replies from lovely ladies batting for a young man on the autistic spectrum. I cant get my head around this situation. The new wife wouldnt have married the dad if she knew this was a possible scenario? I wonder how she'd react if she'd had a child who also had aspergers like his brother? Its come from someplace and if its happened once it can happen again. The boys mum has brought him up single handedly and probably without the amount of services people may think is available to her and her son. And contrary to what people think, that a person who has Aspergers is only a little bit autistic - nothing could be further from the truth. In my mind a person with Aspergers can face more of a challenge in their day to day life than people like my son who are severely autistic. My son and those like him have their feet firmly ensconsed in the world of specials needs and its obvious to everyone, whereas those with aspergers have to battle day to day life as someone with profound special needs living very much in an nt world. It can be a very very hard road to walk. As for mum - why shouldn't she be allowed to try and re-start her career? Maybe she doesnt actually want to, maybe she knows it could affect her son adversely but maybe its something she has to do if only for her financial well being in her old age. I doubt tho its something she'll go ahead with once she's given it more thought, she probably had a few moments of madness when she thought dad and new wife could take over and it would be done nicely and in good spirit. I really do feel for the young lad in this, life is going to be hard enough as it is for him without the burden of his dad and step mum added to the mix. They aren't people he should be expected to put up with and hopefully it won't happen. <em>edited by DesertRose1958 on 15/02/2011</em>
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EW GURU
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 17:42
I can sympathise with your friend a little, it must be hugely daunting to not only take on someone else's almost grown up child, but one with aspergers which can be tricky to deal with when you are familiar with the condition never mind if you are not. She also enjoys her childless life with her husband and understandably doesn't want to give that up. However, if mum has been looking after him all this time, then she deserves a break and why shouldn't dad step up? Your friend would have known her new husband had children, whether or not she was aware of the aspergers, and with that knowledge comes the possibility that they will become your responsibility at some point. If something had happened to the mother as opposed to her just wanting to study, would your friend have just thrown the boy onto the street? Of course not (at least I hope not...!). I suspect she is just in panic mode at her impending life change and as others have said, they all need to sit down together, rein in their feelings and sort out what is best for the boy. Once she learns what the boy is capable of and comes up with some ground rules she may come round. Through thick and thin and ups and downs is what marriage is all about, it would be sad if she forgot that.
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EW GURU
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 17:26
No, actually it's a statistical fact. I read it in some study somewhere (sorry, cannot cite as it was a few years ago) and it stuck because it was so striking. Apparently women are more likely to end a marriage. Men tend only to end the marriage when they have someone else to go to.
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EW EXPLORER
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 17:24
When they met, the hsbd was already a divorced man living in another country but everytime he went back home, he would stay at his ex's house (his as well) because the children were still in school at that time. The ex were not happy when she found out that her ex has moved on. When they got married, they told the eldest child but not the ex. When the ex found out, she went ballistic and said a lot of ugly things and my friend found out about it and well, wouldn't delete it from her memory. I guess living in another country make the "problem" seem so far away. Now that daddy is finally home, well....he is accessible again 8-) MimiM - I don't think my friend care to ask the ex why she suddenly decide to re-start her career at this point of her life. I believe the ex is in her mid 40's.
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EW NEWBIE
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 17:08
Men don't usually initiate a separation without the temptation of a woman in the background. If so, perhaps that is why the ex-wife has been so nasty. WOW, that is some generalisation and complete nonsense!
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EW GURU
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 17:02
Wow, and wow! I totally agree with Amy. Her husband is not responsible for his ex wife's behaviour. The husband's child is not responsible for having Aspergers. She knew about the ex wife and the child when she married the husband presumably. A question...was it your friend who broke up the marriage? Men don't usually initiate a separation without the temptation of a woman in the background. If so, perhaps that is why the ex-wife has been so nasty. In any case, I think your friend is being very vindictive but hurting 2 innocent people who have not asked for any of this - her DH and the son. Perhaps they all need to sit down as a "family" (because like it or not, that's what they are as they are all tied by blood via the son) and nut out a strategy that is accommodating to everyone. It may not involve one single party having the son full time. I also think (dependent on how functional the son is) that it would be very difficult and stressful on the son to move him from one environment to another like that.
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EW NEWBIE
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 16:05
I married my husband knowing that his 2 children came with needing both emotional and financial support from him. I would have neither married nor respected him if he did not provide either. If the situation arose where we became full time carers for whatever length of time it would be difficult but that is what I chose. I am their step-mum, he is their father. But, I would be concerned why the ex cannot provide care and still study with an 18 year old?? Also, what if the situation was reversed and my husband said a child of mine from a previous marriage could not live with us?? And if I had a dollar for every snide remark (that I know of) that the ex wife has said............
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EW GURU
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 15:58
I think your friend is highly selfish and self centered. No man or woman should be asked to choose between someone and their kids. And quite honestly, if I were the husband I would tell her to get packing.
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EW NEWBIE
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 15:56
Give her some times. She is probably petrified by the fact that she will have to get in charge of a 18 years old, who is unfortunatly "different", and who is not her son. Her first reaction is quite normal, and it is better for her to think about it now than later. If she is not 100% ready it will be a disaster for her husband, the boy and herself. Your friend does not want to face the reality and she is scared. She needs to be reassure more than anything else. She prefers to put the blame on the ex than on herself. If she welcomes him it has to come from her heart because even with a lot of help, her life is going to change.
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EW EXPLORER
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 15:55
Glad that I post the thread here as I am getting some really good pointer here as how to go about advising her. My friend is in her late 30's. They have been married for 3 years now with the first 2 years abroad. They live in Australia. So far, the hsbd has told his ex that it's not his decision alone and told my friend that he doesn't want to lose her. I honestly do not think she and her hsbd have sit down and tried to figure out whether or not they could do it. To her...he will work the whole day and as she is staying home, she will end up taking care of the son on her own. I really think that her bad relationship with her hsbd's ex clouded her judgement to the point that she actually willing to throw away the marriage. Took her a long time to meet him too!!! Another issue could be because her hsbd has had vasectomy. In the beginning she was thinking about having her own child with him as he was willing to reverse the procedure. In the end she decided against it as she does love their "just you and me" lifestyle. edited by blimey on 15/02/2011 edited by blimey on 15/02/2011 <em>edited by blimey on 15/02/2011</em>
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EW EXPERT
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 15:41
I was going to ask if the friend lives here because as Amy says, it's much more affordable to have paid staff here to help with the son: maid, driver, nurse etc. As the son is 18, he's probably already had access to a lot of specialised services and may be able to live a relatively independepent life. I doubt his mother would ask your friend's husband to take care of him if he needed 24/7 help-I doubt any mother would do that having cared for a child all his life. So if it's just a case of the father doing his duty to look after his son, I think he should do so as the mum probably deos need a break after all this time.
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EW NEWBIE
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 15:38
I can understand her frustration but for her to turn her back on her DH because he needs to step up and be responsible for his son is not cool. If the mum has been caring for the child all these years then she deserves to do something for herself. Regardless of what happened in the past btwn the ex and your friend, she must see that!? If she leaves a marriage for that, maybe she is not as committed and in love as she might think....which is unfortunate if he is a good man...she might not be as lucky next time round finding a good one. Maybe if you suggested that she speak to her husband about getting someone to come in and help...perhaps he could come and stay if someone else was going to be dealing with the boy? Maybe she should consider how the DH feels and even the boy.
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EW EXPERT
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 15:37
I would be curious to know if the husband discussed this with his wife before agreeing to the son moving in? Does the husband expect his wife to take up where his ex has left off and take full responsibility for his grown child (not a toddler here) and he just pays parenting lip service? or..has he said they will parent together and he will work at understanding his son and caring for his son so the wife does not feel the full burden is on her? If he has done this, reassured his wife that they will be doing this together, I would say she need to rethink her position, calm down and look at it another way, especially if the husband WANTS to have his son live with him or if he is being FORCED into it by the ex........ I think she needs to grow up a bit and get over the ex, drop it and forget about it but she will have to lay down some fair grown rules so they can all live together...and get help if necessary. I do believe there is an aspergers association here that is very active, she could start there. How old is she anyway?
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EW OLDHAND
Latest post on 15 February 2011 - 15:21
I would be very careful how you would advise your friend as you may end up not having a friend at all as the advice she wants to hear is that she is right and that she shouldn't have to help her husband by helping the son which in turn helps the ex. What I would say to her is that its a tricky situation and she has to decide whether or not she will choose to support her husband or whether or not she'll allow her dislike of the ex to ruin her marriage as its not fair for her to put her husband in the position of choosing between his son and his wife. What she could do is ask to put together a schedule. So they have the son for say x amount of time then he goes back to the ex then back to them etc... She could also put a condition that she gets some sort of help so that she isn't burdened being the full care giver of the son.
 
 

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