Toddler discipline

Can someone please tell me how I can get hold of SuperGranny?!?!? SuperGranny does not live in Dubai, she is South African, and as far as I know, travels and comes to Dubai every 3/6months. She does talks and also follow-on consultations. You can contact her through her website. www.monsterstomunchkins.co.za HTH <em>edited by plumie on 21/12/2011</em>

Can someone please tell me how I can get hold of SuperGranny?!?!?

DC a lot of my friends have recommended this book: http://www.amazon.com/Playful-Parenting-Lawrence-J-Cohen/dp/0345442865 as a way of sidestepping bad behaviour before it starts. DS is coming up to 15mo and I am about to place an order for it! Good luck.

Hi DC, been meaning to ask, how did you get on with the supergranny visit? How is your DS doing now? My DS got the hang of time out and even puts himself in time out but over the past few days he's been really pushing the boundaries intentionally with a huge grin on his face ;) Boys are such a challenge... ;) Good to hear she's recommended! A friend also recommended her and said she made a huge difference to her LO's behaviour, so here's hoping :). I think consistency is definitely key, and that's probably what's been lacking especially recently. I've often been stuck on the sofa feeding DD so when he plays up, I've been pretty ineffective. I don't think he has any friends who may have shown him such aggressive behaviour, so I'm even more mystified as to where he's got it from :\:. I can't think of anyone at all I'd prefer he didn't see, unless I've missed something. Ignoring him definitely seems to upset him. I do try and take away whatever he's thrown, and he then doesn't get to play with it. But again, I probably haven't been consistent enough with it. Dad said the other night he thinks I'm over-compensating for DD being around, and I think he may have a point. I've been feeling sorry for him having to share me now, and almost grieving the time we used to have together with just us, so I think I've probably been letting him get away with too much and Dad thinks he's taking advantage. I'm sure he's right but I can't help but feel he's losing out on my time, even though he'll just have to get used to it and he's not alone in having to share attention! :\::\::\:

She has a no nonsense attitude and make you realise the error of your ways but its all good ;) I found mine to be happier now that I am firmer with them (always been firm but not consistently firm) as they seem to like the security the predicatbility/boundaries brings. They now know they have choices (age appropriate ones). If they choose wrong, they suffer the consequences and when they choose correctly, they get the reward (and this does not have to be materialistic). I think, for me at least, it came down to two things, I wanted them to listen first time around (very important) and two, to internalise the difference between right and wrong and teaching them to make the right choices. That is discipline and not punishment, which is short lived and gives instant results but is not sustainable long term. It is of course never too late but the best time to instill this discipline is beteen the ages of 0-6 years. I would definitely recommend you buy her book and she also has reward charts. Your DS may be too young to use it but I bought one for mine anyway, as its hard to find nice ones like hers in Dubai. DD started on her chart and she has been doing brilliantl, with a few steps back here and there but overall, great. I feel more in control and they know I have taken the control back and it just makes for a less stressed household. The real breakthrough comes when you find you are actually now spending quality time with them and not just scolding them when you are together. Good luck for the visit (and be strong!) xx

Read ' Nurture Shock' by Po Brosnan .

Dad said the other night he thinks I'm over-compensating for DD being around, and I think he may have a point. I've been feeling sorry for him having to share me now, and almost grieving the time we used to have together with just us, so I think I've probably been letting him get away with too much and Dad thinks he's taking advantage. I'm sure he's right but I can't help but feel he's losing out on my time, even though he'll just have to get used to it and he's not alone in having to share attention! That may or may not be true, but it's also a fact of life - rare are the times when we can have someone's undivided attention and there it Life Lesson #1 right there. Don't feel sorry for him - he's loved and is in a caring family, well-provided for and nurtured. Trying to find the balance in your attitude towards both your children will be your life from now on - DH and I had a little chat a couple of nights ago about how we may (royal we there) be dealing with DS differently or more harshly than with DD during his more difficult behaviour and how we [cough'> have to remember that DD went through the same things and that we should be fair. It's not about compensating, it's about giving each one what they need, preferably when they need it, but if not, when you can. DD always played up, or rather decided she suddenly wanted cuddles/a book/ some milk/ to go out when I was feeding DS because that is the main crunch point when you have to give attention to #2 and can't do anything else. I got around it by latching DS on, getting DD next to me on the sofa and just talking to her or reading to her, whilst seemingly ignoring DS... so I was fulfilling both children's needs at once. Nifty! If you know that in certain situations your attempts to discipline will be ineffective, then just like a general, not only pick your battle, but engineer the battlefield - manipulate the situation so that it doesn't come to having to discipline... basically, give him something interactive and interesting to do for the duration of the crunch-point, rather than let him continue playing by himself. You dad sounds a bit like mine. Mine declared that DD was spoilt because I talk to her to find out why she's kicking off into a tantrum. He thinks I should completely ignore her, whilst I know that if I do, she will (and has proved it many a time) scream for up to an hour, whereas if I ask her why she's upset, she won't scream at all, because she doesn't need to... she still doesn't get her way, but she's got her message across and that's what matters to her. He also declared that she was manipulative when she was about 8 weeks old and yes, the term "taking advantage" and "getting away with it" also pops up quite a bit. I wish he wouldn't use those terms, and it really upset me to hear about what he thought of his granddaughter, since it was mainly unfounded, but hey, he's of the "don't do as I do, do as I tell you" school, which, well... yeah. No... ... and you know I'm no push-over mum with her prize Little Angels!

Hi DC, some great advice on here. Just wanted to assure you that Supergranny is great. We just had a visit from her the past weekend and my ones are showing a huge improvement. Get her book (it seems to cover everything she will go through with you during the session as well). The visit was well worth it and I feel refreshed to keep going with my two. Good luck and remember consistency pays off. Easier said than done when you are dead tired but it really is the magic word and will all work out in the end. Hugs xxx I know I've posted on this before but I'm feeling a bit down about it today. DS was a horror - utterly, absolutely, unbelievably awful. He had a friend round for a playdate and spent the afternoon hitting him, pushing him over and generally being a vile bully. Then he spent our walk trying to kick his five-week-old sister below him in the buggy, and finally when we got home ran up and smacked her round the head. The rest of his day was spent alternately attacking the Christmas tree, throwing things (something he does all the time), jumping on the coffee table or bouncing on the sofas. I was so embarrassed I wanted to cry. Me telling him no, or putting him in time out in the naughty corner, has absolutely no effect whatsoever. Shouting at him has no effect either. Dad is staying with us at the moment and it seems we don't share the same opinion on methods of discipline. He thinks DS should get a smack for his behaviour. I don't see how we can teach him not to hit people if we're then going to hit him. We have a visit scheduled from SuperGranny (the Monsters to Munchkins lady) on Monday but my main issue is that I really don't agree with smacking him as punishment. I want him to respond to calm discipline, not violence. I know I'm his mother and it should be up to DH and I but DH also thinks he should get a smack (despite having been on the receiving end of awful beatings from his own father), so I'm fighting my corner alone :(. Any suggestions? edited by DubaiCat on 06/12/2011

Whenever he is calm, praise him and make him feel super special. When he is naughty, try to ignore it.....obviously keep him safe, but don't let him think he has your attention.

Thanks Freckles, only problem is thats its easy to be objective when you are away from the situation but when you are tired and emotionally drained to does tend to go out the window somewhat, I stick notes to myself on the fridge to remind me of my plans sometimes and readily admit to not always following them. touching wood for you too! Also, most mums (who care about what their child is doing) will be absolutely mortified every time their own child is violent. It's really difficult to explain the deep embarrassment at such behaviour - I always used to think "oh yeah, excuses excuses" when I'd hear other mums going "but I just don't understand it - it's so unlike him/her"... until DD's teacher told me that DD had sunk her teeth into another child. I think that's also partially where the idea/ instinct comes to go and give the other child a cuddle and make a fuss of them... just because you are so shocked and sorry that the littler person you've been nurturing seems to have turned into such a horror. I tend to just make sure that the other child isn't badly hurt (hoping that their own mum will pop by) and concentrate on reinforcing the message to my own. I also agree with Kiwispiers - if the situation appears just way too difficult for LO to deal with, then you have to remove them to allow them to calm down and focus.

Thanks Freckles, only problem is thats its easy to be objective when you are away from the situation but when you are tired and emotionally drained to does tend to go out the window somewhat, I stick notes to myself on the fridge to remind me of my plans sometimes and readily admit to not always following them. touching wood for you too!

totally hijacking the thread here, but just want to say Kiwispers, when i have kids (hopefully soon knock on wood) i hope i have the sense of mind and the thought process you do! reading your post, i was nodding me head, thinking wow, thats excellent advice!! Hope it helps you DC xx

Will start by pointing out that I am completely unqualified to comment (apart from a background in psychology, but I would listen to an experienced mother over someone with a psych degree ;) so feel free to ignore), DS is only 16 months and we haven't hit this obstacle (YET), but we are on the receiving end of it quite often. Based on observation and theory, hitting a child will frighten them, not teach them empathy nor provide them with tools to negotiate what they want in a socially appropriate way, so its not very forward thinking, if nothing else. As a parent your role as teacher is obviously important. You are also responsible for intervening if your child is hurting/scaring others. 2) We just use very firm 'no's' - I lower my voice and say it very firmly. I physically remove him from the situation, get down to his level (not that easy at the moment with a fat belly!!) and tell him no, that he can't do that, that he needs to be gentle with XXX - I use the words I know he understands - so no, need to be gentle etc I also tell him we have to stop playing if he isn't a good boy - and I mean it, if he continued doing it, I would just end the play date. I tell him to go and say sorry, and give them a kiss/cuddle. . Totally agree with the saying sorry, the only thing I'd caution about is the giving the other child a kiss/cuddle, I have a friend who does this every time her child hits/pushes/hurts mine (which is quite often)and to be honest I'd prefer she didn't. My child is upset and I'm busy teaching him how to move away from the aggressor, instead he gets forced to stand there while the other child comes up and gets right into his personal space. I see the theory in it but its frightening for my child and also the aggressor then gets praise, which is sending a conflicting message. Apart from that, I like Tanya's approach. Use very simple words to reflect his age. "stop, stop, gentle, gentle, soft touch" combined with physical redirection (moving hands away or moving your child completely). If your child has taken a toy return the toy to the other child and say "no car, Lucy has the car, you play with the ball" and again physically redirect. I think when a child continues with an agressive behaviour at a play date after a few warnings you follow through by IMMEDIATELY packing up and leaving the very next time the behaviour occurs. It needs to be instant for the connection to be made so once you say "We are leaving because you were not gentle" then you leave, you don't stand around and chat for another 5 minutes while your child continues to play because if you do the message is lost. ( I say this because I see it happen all the time). I think before resorting to this you would physically redirect rough play and in the case of something like hitting temporarily remove your child from play "you can't play with Lucy right now because you are hitting", no need to go into a spiel about "you will now have 5 minutes of time out" etc or forcing them to sit on the spot if they are too young to comply. Its about a natural consequence, "you don't play nicely you don't get played with". If you think your child's friends are partially the cause you need to think hard about your priorities and consider how much time you want him to spend with certain kids. If you could isolate the more gentle ones and invite them to one-on-one playdates at yours it might be better for him. As far as when he's not around his friends, the only personal experience I have is that we have a blanket "no throwing" rule, applies even to balls although with your DS being older you could maybe implement "balls are ok IF you outside"). Anything that gets thrown gets taken away (you could have a box out of his reach and make a point of saying "no throwing, truck gone now". (and its gone for an hour, a day whatever, I think you don't need to explain all that to him at this age, just the fact that its gone for now is message enough). Then ignore him, move on to another game and don't discuss the behaviour further or talk about earning toys back again, he's too young for complex explanations, just another simple natural consequence is enough. For DS, he went through a phase of pulling my hair to get my attention, he was laughing but it really hurt. I gave him an "inverse time out". Basically I said no, gentle etc then if it continued I said "mummy is going away" and got up and shut myself in the laundry for a minute or so. He hated it (cried miserably) and I only had to do it a few times before I could simply say "mummy will go away" and that was enough to stop him in his tracks (so if that can work at 15 months your DS can get that at his age). Your guy being older he may tantrum and throw things while you are gone, but the being ignored should still have an effect. Don't over use it though, I'd reserve it for when he is physically dangerous not just for couch jumping etc, for those case you could just put him on the floor silently and move away from the couch. Consider a safe zone for your baby (within a playpen etc) and obviously praise praise praise DS whenever he is soft and gentle with her so that the bulk of attention he gets is positive. I have just ordered a book online called 1,2,3 discipline (or something like that) which a friend recommended. Her little boy is an angel so I'm hoping the book is somewhat to credit for that. You need to have along and lengthy discussion with DH, explain that regardless of what mode of discipline you choose you need to be a team and that although you are both parents YOU are the one dealing with this for the most part, you NEED him to support YOUR chosen method even if he doesn't agree its the best one. Explain that feeling alone is making your life even more stressful and tell him EXACTLY what you propose he does instead of smacking. Men are simple creatures :) they want to provide for their wives but they need constant reminders that their emotional support is more important than their "solutions". Tell him exactly what you need and thank him when he gives it.

oh yes... reading Hiccough's post... saying sorry. Very important. Because of the fact DS wasn't talking very well, I taught him the sign for sorry, as well as the word, and so he pretty much always says sorry if he's done something wrong. I also make a point of saying sorry to him (or DD) if I have done something I should not have. Don't be too proud to not be able to apologise!

OK... firstly, apparently it's normal for the elder sibling to have a bit of a "phase" at 5 or 6 weeks after their younger sibling has arrived because it suddenly dawns on them that they're not going away, and the novelty has worn off. Secondly, your son is entering the frustrating age of having more complex emotions and needs but not being able to express them adequately in words, so reverts to the communication tools he has to hand - crying, screaming and getting physical. This isn't condoning it or forgiving it, so to speak, but it's just to say that although it's mortifying, it is "normal"... DS is going through a hitting phase at the moment too and DD did as well. DD got so bad, in fact, that I avoided playdates for a while because I couldn't be more than 50 cm away from her, lest she lay into another child... and being a big little girl, they had no chance (a bit like with DS now...) You just need to give them the tools to cope and get through it. ... and you're right. Smacking as punishment isn't helpful at all - it doesn't actually teach them anything apart from "yes, you can hit someone if you're angry or frustrated at them, as long as they are smaller than you"... er.... Also (and my Dad is very much of the smacking school too), it demonstrates that the adult who smacks is no better than the toddler at conflict resolution - how can we expect the child to resolve its issues through calm words if we can't? I was smacked as a child and it never stopped me... I just learnt to hide my digressions better. Anyhow, hitting is a constant issue with my two, whether it's just playing getting a bit out of hand or proper unprovoked swiping... I go in the hope that constant reinforcement will gradually sink in. Try to think what the message behind it is and give the alternative in words (or kind gestures) - for example, DS has taken to hitting quite hard to get someone's attention, so I say "No, there's no need to hit, you just need to touch my arm and say "mummy!"" or "If you want to play with DD, don't hit, just say "DD, play with me!"" For DD, who is older and can communicate well, her hitting is to do with impulse (she takes after me and I know myself too well on this matter), so I've had to go down the anger management route with her (at 4 years old?!), so with her, we've gone through "if you feel angry or sad, and want to hit, you have to STOP and think about what is the right thing to do" and after some role play and some heavy reinforcement, she does it more often than not... to the point where she's spreading the word when there's a dispute at nursery! And lastly, you know what, sometimes they just have "days"... got out of bed the wrong way, bit grumpy, wants to just lash out a bit. I have those days. One horrid day does not a Terror make. ;)

Hitting might possibly be the worst thing you do to him now. He needs more love and reassurance. Giving him priority over baby will work wonders. Trust me on those lines. Been there done that.

Oh DC! I am with you with the no hitting policy. I was met with a lot of negativity and the bad parent tag everytime DS did something wrong and all I did was take him out of the situation immediately, divert his mind, calm him down first and then talk about why what he did was wrong ( they understand a bit even at that age). I always made sure he knew I was upset. Today I don't have to resort to hitting (i would confess to shouting) for anything. He is a very loving child and he would apologize immediately if he knows mom and dad are not happy. I am sure its a phase and With new baby in house tantrums are pretty normal occurrence! Hang on there and follow your heart. Thankfully DH and I have the same parenting style!

There is a chapter on a siblings rivalry and routines with siblings in 'Toddler Years'.

Ohhh! I completely feel for you, this is an absolute hot topic in our household at the moment - and I am of completely the same school of thought - there is absolutely no smacking in our household (actually funnily enough it is illegal to smack a child in our home country NZ!) We are also a no yelling or shouting household. From memory our DS's are similar ages (mine is 22months) - but I am fortunate than our no 2 is still 'cooking' - so I am not juggling no. 2 for a couple more months. I am actually working at the moment, so not around DS all the time, so I have had to provide instruction with our Nanny on how to manage his behaviours. I know I am doing this when I am around him, but I can't say with absolute certainty that it is happening 100% of the time. I am not sure I am quite in the position to comment (and people who know me on here might come on and laugh at me!!) but here we go! To be honest this has really only recently become a problem, and so I am now trying to put in place tactics of how to deal with this. DS has a couple of older (by between 3-6 months) friends who are quite rough, and push, hit, put in headlocks etc all the time, some of the parents think it is funny, laugh and clap (not kidding unfortunately) and others are desparately trying to stop the behaviour as well. Our DS socialises with these children at least once a day, and has come home with scratches, bruises and bite marks, so it is a problem, and recently DS has taken to retaliating, which isn't acceptable - which is clearly your viewpoint as well. although some parents scarily tell their kids to pay back to make it even..... not my method of parenting!! We haven't tried the naughty chair or corner yet, because (to be honest) I don't think he is old enough to understand what it means - I think we are still a couple of months away. So we are working to following school of thought: 1) Absolute consistency, every time we see something we don't want him doing, we deal with the behaviour, we don't let it slide. They can't judge when it is acceptable and not acceptable to do things, so if they sometimes get pulled up, and not others, it is confusing, and eradicates all the hard work done previously. This is very difficult for you at the moment to be honest when you have a little DD to be looking after too! 2) We just use very firm 'no's' - I lower my voice and say it very firmly. I physically remove him from the situation, get down to his level (not that easy at the moment with a fat belly!!) and tell him no, that he can't do that, that he needs to be gentle with XXX - I use the words I know he understands - so no, need to be gentle etc I also tell him we have to stop playing if he isn't a good boy - and I mean it, if he continued doing it, I would just end the play date. I tell him to go and say sorry, and give them a kiss/cuddle. 3) We 'try' to ensure all the kids are pulled up for the same behaviour when they are together, obviously this is a bit difficult when some parents/caregivers think it is funny - which means it tends to be myself and one other mother hauling the kids off each other... In our house with the Christmas tree, it has been a no touch zone, and I was really firm about this from the outset (it has only been up for 3 days now) but DS has been very, very good. He wanted to touch it to start with, I said very firmly 'no', gave him a decoration of his choice that he could play with from the tree - and told him only for looking, no touching. It is the same rules for the rest of the kids that come around, because I can't expect DS to not touch it, and let the other kids touch it because they are visitors. Kids don't understand there are different rules for different people. As I said, we are just starting down this route, and I am at work for the next 3 weeks, so I can only ensure I am doing this when I am home, I am lucky to have a Nanny who agrees with approach on this situation, but I think she finds it uncomfortable when she is in playgroups with no parents present that the others just giggle and think the fighting is funny with the children they are looking after. Fortunately, there is usually one Mummy who is at a lot of the play dates, who knows (and has the same mentality of how to deal with these things) so she helps manage these situations - even though her DD is an absolute angel and never involved in any of the aggressive behaviour - although the victim at times :( Not sure if that helps, and possibly all things you have heard before! But this is our school of thought at the moment - he is doing okay with it, and his behaviour definitely isn't getting worse.

DC, I am sorry to hear about your day. I can sympathize - I have 20 months old and 4 weeks old :). To learn how to deal with two under two I resorted to Gina Ford. I was not very supportive of her (although all I knew about her approach was a 2nd hand information). A couple of days ago I bought a 'Toddler Years', she covers all the problems including tantrums. The guidlines she gives on how to deal with tantrums are: diversion, time out, holding time, withdrawing attention. She also writes about agressive behaviour and certainly does not encourage to fight violence with violence. I bought the book in Borders in Mall of the Emirates. Funny enough today bought the 'the new contented little baby' to put some structure in our lives. Hope it will work for us. Take care. X