Close to giving up on BF.... In urgent need of a pep talk from nursing mums!

I couldn´t agree more with DubaiCat. I did the same with my son, i exclusively BF him, didn´t express, so i did all the work....he would feed every 2.5-3 h all the time, day and night....i ended up feeling quite miserable.... It is basic that you rest. If you don´t want to use formula, express so that your husband can feed him and little by little reduce the feeds at night. I think we sometimes think they´re hungry and it´s not the case, it´s more wanting you to be there etc... And, then each kid is different....mine was a nightmare, didn´t sleep through the night till he was over 18 months (although changed to formula at about 6 months) whereas i have a friend who kept breastfeeding till baby was 1 year old and her baby started sleeping through the night at 6-7 months! YOU ARE NOT DOING ANYTHING WRONG!!!! each baby is different and some are more demanding.....hang in there, i promise it will soon pass!

Some great advice on here Sunsa. Also wanted to share my experience with you. DD was a great sleeper right up until she hit about 4 months at which point suddenly she started waking up every couple hours at night. I put this down to the 4 month sleep regression, but then when it went on for several weeks, the lack of sleep really started to get to us! I then realized that DD had sort of switched her days and nights, i.e. because she was so distracted during the day she was not feeding properly (as she preferred to play and look up around her instead of concentrate on her feeding!) she was getting more of her calories at night by feeding every few hours. Also, at her bed time feed (around 7pm) and most of her night feeds she would fall asleep within minutes of starting to feed and so would be up again in a couple hours as she was hungry. To try and break this cycle, I basically pumped a little more for a few days and started giving her the bottle a few times during the day (i gave around 3-4oz at 1pm, 3-4oz at 4pm), and then again 4oz at her bed time 7pm feed and again at around 11pm or 11:30pm. With the bottle, I could be sure that she was taking in enough milk, and thankfully, she went back to her earlier sleep patterns. Now I only pump 2 4oz bottles a day - I give her one at 7pm and then she sleeps straight through until 11 or 11:30pm at which time DH gives her another bottle. Then she normally only wakes once at night at around 3am. Am not sure if this would work for everyone, but it worked for us so may be worth trying. <em>edited by GreenQueen on 02/05/2011</em>

I'm a great advocate of feeding on demand - don't forget that milk is not only food but also drink. I sometimes wake up randomly at night and decide I'm a bit thirsty so trundle off and get something - not on schedule! [shock horror'> Actually, I quite fancy a cuppa now, but only had my last 45 minutes ago... should I wait another 3h15 or actually listen to my body telling me I'm thirsty? I also think we all get caught up in the fear of Baaaad Habits (I did) and in the fear of bringing up a "comfort-feeder", "snacker", "whatever", lose sight of the fact that they're babies and babies either want to eat, sleep or be loved. Sure, the lines can sometimes get blurred, but there's no habit that can't be broken. As for the solids, it's all about reading what your baby needs and is comfortable with. I think I introduced a new meal every week - so a week doing dinner, then the following week breakfast and dinner and then the third doing breakfast, lunch and dinner. I wouldn't say it's The Way - just my way, that worked for me and my children. I'm an impatient person really and just wanted to get on with it! lol

Agree with Dubai cat, talk to Cecile. Breastfed babies can and do sleep through the night with sleep training from as early as a few weeks, i speak from experience. Formula will not make baby sleep through, good sleep habits will! You've done the hardest part now get some help. Good luck!

I'm not sure if Cecile advocates the Gina Ford method but I don't subscribe to that school of thought and I felt totally comfortable taking Cecile's advice. ETA: Have to run out for an hour but will post more about what we did when I get in if you need. <em>edited by DubaiCat on 01/05/2011</em>

Hi Sunsa. DD just started to sleep through the night at 14 months (i.e. sleeps by 9 wakes up at 6.00 am for a bottle and goes back down till about 8.30 am however, kicks the heck out of DH and me between 3 and 5 am while still asleep). At 6 months, she was waking twice to thrice at night for a feed. She was on two solids a day (bfast and dinner). I introduced formula at 9 months (night bottle) and it did not make a bit of difference to her sleep patterns! So if you want to introduce formula to get her to sleep better, it might or might not work. Introducing formula so DH or someone else can feed her will def give you more sleep! You arent doing anything wrong. You are doing great! Dont beat yourself up about it. I too used to wonder why DD kept waking up at night when everyone else's kids were sleeping through the night at 6 weeks! All babies are different. Sorry you are exhausted. Take care of yourself and make the best decision for you and your daughter.

Is your LO in your room with you? Babies are noisy little sleepers and sometimes moms actually wake their little ones up when they think they are about to wake up. Maybe try putting her in the next room and only going to get her if she really howls. Since mine are in their own room, they still wake up, but really only once or twice a night each (night being from 7pm to 630am). The other thing would be to make sure the room is really, really dark. No night light. <em>edited by guinness on 01/05/2011</em>

Also, a lot of people's interpretations of what constitutes "sleeping through the night" varies enormously. I've heard a good number of mums proudly announce that their baby slept through from 2 weeks old, only to then add that they only woke for 2 feeds. That ain't sleeping through, then, is it?! lol Ain't that the truth. I got so utterly sick and tired of people crowing about how their little darlings slept through the night, only to discover that 'sleeping through the night' for them was a feed at 11pm and 4am! And anyway, even if they did sleep through the night, I didn't want to hear about it, thanks.

You're not doing anything wrong - quite the contrary in fact! You've done really well, got a nice bedtime routine and although it may not feel like it, her waking is pretty normal - DD slept through (without a dream-feed or waking at all) at 9 months and my son at 11 months. Don't believe the formula hype of making babies sleep better - there's no evidence it does. Also, a lot of people's interpretations of what constitutes "sleeping through the night" varies enormously. I've heard a good number of mums proudly announce that their baby slept through from 2 weeks old, only to then add that they only woke for 2 feeds. That ain't sleeping through, then, is it?! lol However, I do have a suggestion, since your baby is 6 months old - introduce more solid meals. It may help... it may not. Both my 2 were on 3 meals a day at 6 months, with a pudding after lunch and dinner. DD cut down her night feeds to only one at around about the same time and DS... didn't. He was still on 2h-4h-6h until he turned 11 months, at which point he dropped them all and slept through! I hope this helps.

Haven't responded yet as my DD2 (2.5 years) has only just started sleeping through the night and I didn't want to depress you!!!! You're doing nothing wrong, and all the BF'ing you do is wonderful. I finished a year and a half ago, unfortunately it didn't really help with the sleeping, but I feel I've given her a wonderful start. Chin up, parenting is hard.

Sunsa - I hear you. I have a 5.5 month old who is exclusively breastfed and he is worse - Its a tough job to get him to sleep most nights. We do have a night time routine - bath, breast and bed. Some days he goes down easy other days its a struggle. He has a dream feed around 11 - 11.30 depending on his last feed ( 8 - 8.30pm) and he wakes up quite a few times in the night. Only the breast works - no pacifier/ cuddling / rocking. During the day he easlily goes 3.5 hour between feeds some days even 4 hours - but night times its anywhere between 2.5 - 3 hours. I don't have the heart to let him cry it out in the night and honestly I'd rather get up feed him and go back to sleep than deal with a crying baby in the middle of the night as I am wasted at the end of the day. Ellaar have you tried clustering feeds during the day so that your LO doesn't cluster feed at night? I would suggest perhaps feeding 3 hourly during the day so that he'll extend overnight. This may help with the o/n wakeups. Encourage more calories during the day so he's not so hungry overnight.

Sunsa - I hear you. I have a 5.5 month old who is exclusively breastfed and he is worse - Its a tough job to get him to sleep most nights. We do have a night time routine - bath, breast and bed. Some days he goes down easy other days its a struggle. He has a dream feed around 11 - 11.30 depending on his last feed ( 8 - 8.30pm) and he wakes up quite a few times in the night. Only the breast works - no pacifier/ cuddling / rocking. During the day he easlily goes 3.5 hour between feeds some days even 4 hours - but night times its anywhere between 2.5 - 3 hours. I don't have the heart to let him cry it out in the night and honestly I'd rather get up feed him and go back to sleep than deal with a crying baby in the middle of the night as I am wasted at the end of the day. I tried expressing but it seems more exhausting than getting up to feed - a feed only takes 10 minutes but expressing takes me 20 minutes (15 mts expressing and cleaning etc) so I went back to feeding him myself. Added to this DS has reflux and hence things are a little worse here - I am scared that his reflux might worsen if we introduce formula. DH is stressing that we should give him formula in the night once he is six months but am still not too convinced and I kind of feel guilty that I am denying him BF and being selfish. He is not yet into solids and I want to wait until he takes solids twice a day before I give in and take the formula route. I just hope it gets better for us soon and this is just a phase and this too will pass. Hugs and Good luck to you ! <em>edited by ellaar on 30/04/2011</em>

Lovely post DC. Sunsa my DD is 7weeks, doing exactly the same as yours but BOY if she is still doing it at 6 months, I am SO going to give her a bottle or 2 of formula. I also went to Cecile and by 6 weeks she said mine should have dropped the 12 o'clock feed - if their weight is good then it's just a feed out of habit not necessity. I had to give a late (11pm) dream feed and then refuse to feed again until 2am (rough for 2 nights and then fine) but I must say, I didn't have the heart for the "cry it out" method, I just picked her up and rocked and walked with her and then put her in the bed with me when she quieted until 2am and then fed her. It worked. But I have a tin of formula at the ready - and I won't feel guilty if I have to use it; you have done more than your fair share by 6 months, be kind to yourself now! :)

Sunsa I think there is this expectation that babies should be sleeping through the night from such a young age. There are of course, those that do - and these are the one's you hear about. However, so many babies still need those extra calories overnight to make up adequete caloric intake. You're doing an amazing job! Well done to you for bf-ing for as long as you have. But you're obviously stressed about this and you have to do what suits you. Don't give up bf-ing completely. There are other options. As shjbelle suggested - you could try the good-night formula for the dreamfeed at night to fill her up more. Also - as she's just started taking solids - increase the amount or number of solid meals she's getting to try and get the maximum calories in during the day. Why not offer solids twice per day. I personally found (and this may or may not work for you!) that my LO's always had only one period at night where they slept for a long period of time. Now if your LO is going down at 7pm and you're giving a dreamfeed at 12am then that's a long stretch. Why not try doing the dreamfeed at say 10pm (so there's only 3 hrs since the last feed) and aim to extend the long sleep period through the middle of the night. This way you can get to bed earlier and get some much needed rest. Alternatively, if you decide to switch to formula for the dreamfeed - perhaps DH could do that one for you? I currently do this - however, I express at 9pm, tuck myself into bed and DH feeds my LO at 10pm so I get at least a good 4-5 hours of solid sleep before the next feed. I can't do the lying down feed - I'm not coordinated enough and I end up with a very wet bed! :) It won't be long before this sleeplessness all seems so long ago! Very soon your LO will be sleeping through the night (I promise!). HTH

1. You are not doing anything wrong. 2. You are not doing anything wrong. 3. You are not doing anything wrong. OK?! I was in the same boat as you a few months ago. I resisted giving DS formula so hard, because it made me feel like such a failure as a BF mother (and I don't mean that giving him formula was bad - I mean that when people suggested giving him formula it made me feel that my milk wasn't good enough and I wasn't doing a good enough job). And, every breastfeeding counsellor I spoke to said formula wouldn't make the slightest bit of difference to his sleep. I was so utterly exhausted, I ended up literally banging my head against the wall in frustration one sleepless night, much to DH's alarm! I think he thought he was going to have to call the men in white coats (and I ended up with one h3ll of a headache). Basically, by continuing to feed on demand through the night, I was teaching DS that he needed a) me and b) a boob to get himself back to sleep. I certainly wasn't doing anything 'wrong' by feeding him, but I was making it that much harder for myself. We ended up going to see Cecile and she gave us advice on how to break the cycle. It involved a little bit of crying - well, more like shouting, as there were no tears - but within a few nights he was down to a dream feed at 11pm and a small feed at 4am. Then within a week or so he dropped the 4am feed, and now since 10 months he's dropped the dream feed too and sleeps from 7.30pm until 7am (ish). We did make the dream feed and the 4am feed formula, as I was keen to break the association between me and meals and I wanted DH to get his backside out of bed for once! And I was far too exhausted to pump. I don't think the outcome would have been any different if we'd fed him EBM in a bottle, though. I think the most important lesson I've learned since I had DS is this: I can't look after him if I don't look after myself. Months of extreme sleep deprivation on end does not a happy mummy make, and I honestly believe I was headed for a breakdown. I couldn't function and take care of a child in that state and neither can you. Just do what you think is best for both of you. You being so sleep deprived you can't function is not best for either of you. Hope you get something sorted soon x ETA: And one more thing I learned: Go to bed early. Sleep when the LO sleeps during the day. Do whatever it takes to make sure you get enough rest. I tried for ages to carry on - I felt I was missing out on my life by sleeping in the day and going to bed ridiculously early - but I felt so much better for getting more rest. edited by DubaiCat on 30/04/2011 <em>edited by DubaiCat on 30/04/2011</em>

Hugs to you Sunsa... I think you are doing a brilliant job... My DD was also exclusively breastfed..til about a month ago when I introduce formula to her, which til today, I only give for her dream feed...the rest of the day she's on b/milk and on solids for lunch. I think it's ok.. Like you I was nearly going mental without my sleep.. :D Now she sleeps all thru the night..which is a blessing for me :)