Eat, sleep, drink schedule for a 7 month old

This is your daily routine: 6 am: wakeup after a dream snack of BM 7:30am: breakfast- fruit puree mixed with weetabix/yougurt/cerelac 8am: short nap of not more than 20 mins 10am: massage, bath, breast feed and sleep for one and a half hour 12 noon: lunch- preferably whatever is being cooked at home, is mashed up 2pm: breast feed and sleep for half an hour 4pm: dinner- whatever food group has been missed since morning 6pm: bath, breastfeed and sleep for night 10pm-6am: wakes up every 2 or 3 hours for a BM snack ( its so difficult) This is what happened for me and my twins: 6 am: wakeup after formula ( I breastfed until 4 months and stopped producing after that due to stress of being an expat mom of twins) 7:30am: breakfast- fruit puree mixed with baby cereal 8am: Play time 10am: Formula and sleep for no longer than an hour 12 noon: lunch- chunky homemade baby food and a taste of what's being cooked at home. Dessert, chunky fruit puree. 2pm: formula and sleep for one and a half hour 3:30 pm: snack ( baby arrowroot cookies, melba toast, or apple) , then Play time 4pm: bath time 6pm: dinner- whatever food group has been missed since morning 7pm: Play time, read a book for baby. 7:30 PM:pm sleep for the night 8pm-6am: wakes up once for formula snack, around 11 - midnight

salome, i have always largely agreed with what you say..as there has been strong science behind it but i think most of the posters get offended with your direct ( and sometimes very dramatic/offensive/scary) posts which mince no words... exactly, it is fine to explain your views (hopefully), I just think some of the back and forth has become a bit personal which gets in the way of the overall message. I agree. If we left out claims that border on the hysterics and the personal attacks on others from both sides of the fence, maybe we'd be able to have a very interesting discussion! I also want to say that I never doubted Salome having the best or truest of intentions with her posts, and that it was never for the purpose of promoting her own agenda/business at the expense of others, which some posters have insinuated. This is why I had originally written in an earlier post that I thought some of the things she said did more to harm her than others. I think she has an important message to say. She'll even be surprised how many would agree with her including myself. <em>edited by lemondrops on 22/06/2011</em>

Ssshhht Salome, or ''they'' will think there is a conspiracy going on...;)

Thanks Spamm !

Thanks Pentel . I dont work for myself but for a private company . I am leaving Dubai soon. I know that a lot of posters will enjoy reading this . Good luck to everybody ! edited by salome on 22/06/2011 salome, i have always largely agreed with what you say..as there has been strong science behind it but i think most of the posters get offended with your direct ( and sometimes very dramatic/offensive/scary) posts which mince no words...

wow... I really dont understand why this thread has gone to personal attack... I dont agree on cecile's method, can I share my view or is it not allowed on this forum ? I am really wondering why it is soooo controversial to not agree with her ??? And please, I am not judging anyone. This is a real shortcut and really caricatural. agree with you spamm- it seems like cecile has a lot of fans. For those of us who have never used her help..we have been given to understand that she is strong fan of sleep schedules and cry it out... My input about my own babies here- my 3 year old only started sleeping through at about 17-18 months when i night weaned him after he was able to understand converstaion about time, morning etc and thats when he would get milk. Not much help for me as i was already pregnant with DS 2 (5 months preg). My now 14 month old DS2, just like his brother did at that age wakes up for night feeds- usually 1-2 times a night but this varies. He was recently ill vomitting and once he got better, he woke up 4 times in one night (probably to regain some lost calories) DS1 is a champion sleeper now despite no sleep training at all and all his night wakings till 18 months...he sleeps a solid 10 hrs at night and has a day nap of 1 1/2 to 2 hrs a day. I read somewhere that it all evens out by the time they are 2-2.5 yrs. The scheduled ones and the unscheduled ones, the cry it outs and and fed on demands, the co-sleepers and the own cribbers. My own experience has been the same. DS1 - schdeuled feeds, EBM form a bottle to give mommy more free time etc etc,picky eater of solids, hated purees and spoons- now has the smae schedule as all his 3 yr old friends. DS2- no schedules, no bottles, fed on demand- following absolutely the same sleep and development patterns as DS1 - only he is substantially higher on the growth and head circumference charts at the same age...I will see when he is 3 what is the difference. I think sleep depraviation,stress worry are all part of the deal when we become mommies and we like to believe we are doing what is best for our babies ( and we are - no matter if we follow different methods and ideologies - we are the BEST mommies for our babies and they love us to bits) and maybe thats why we get defensive when someone critizes the methodolgy we follow.....

Sunsa let's not get too down on Salome, I think what she is saying comes from a good place even if has unfortunately gone the way of an attack against Cecile. I am personally not for letting small babies have crying based sleep training and don't think it is developmentally appropriate to expect a newborn to "self soothe" if they do happen to wake in the night. I also agree there are medically recognised dangers in ignoring a newborn's hunger cry. The problem is that even though you would expect parents to take advice with a little common sense, and I'm sure most do, I have read more than once on forums where parents of babies as young as 3 weeks old have left them crying nonstop for hours and hours (the worst I read was 12 solid hours) in an effort to "train them". I have no idea about Cecile or her ethos/techniques so I'm not commenting specifically on her. From what I have read on this forum, her advice does sound similar to that of my MIL, who like Gina Ford was a maternity nurse in the early 70s and this was basically what they were taught. While I don't agree with a lot of what my MIL says, I do know that, it too comes from a good place and she is a compassionate and loving woman. (and my husband who was "trained" this way certainly hasn't grown up as a detached, psychopath.) At a guess, you are feeding or rocking your baby to sleep, which was probably fine when she was under around 4 months old when they for the most part sleep when they are tired regardless of routines/associations. They have brain changes at around the 4 months mark which means they wake up more at the end of each sleep cycle (as do adults). Babies are still learning about sleep, and if they are uses to falling asleep in mum's arms, or with something in their mouth (a dummy/bottle or a boob) and it is not there when they wake then they will often struggle to fall asleep without it. Which translates to, at worst, 45 minute waking, all night. I wonder if she wakes after 20 minutes, not because of gas but because she has fallen asleep with a boob in her mouth and woken without it? At 7 months, she is beginning to understand object permanence, so she may or may not yet understand that if you leave a room you still exist and are coming back. If not, she may find you not coming when she calls for you in the night, very frightening. You have various options for removing her sleep associations if you want to. They range from no-cry techniques (google the "pantly pulloff") to limited crying (baby whisperer: pick-up put down), to various crying techniques where you leave the baby alone and either return periodically or stay away for as long as it takes. From experience the "no cry" techniques are not overnight solutions, they take quite a long time and requite a lot of patience. I think we all have different levels of being able to function without sleep and the solutions you choose will be influenced by that as well as by your own ethic/beliefs. It is better not to judge what another mother has chosen to do or speculate on why she has chosen to do so. There is a good e-book available that runs through a few of the most popular techniques and may be useful to you. http://www.babysleepanswers.co.uk/, without you having to buy and read several books. I found it quite useful and went on to read a few of the books mentioned in it. All the best Emma

Thanks Pentel . I dont work for myself but for a private company . I am leaving Dubai soon. I know that a lot of posters will enjoy reading this . Good luck to everybody ! <em>edited by salome on 22/06/2011</em>

strange goings on here.. my posts seem to have gone?? anyway.. salome, maybe you'd like to share where you work and then if Mums' want to see you professionally as an alternative to Cecille they can? Sunsa... what has definately paid off for me is the general rule that if DD woke up with a cry during the day then she was rocked/fed/cuddled back to sleep. I also used to let her fall asleep feeding (it was a welcome relief to all that room pacing!!) but then I would hold her upright for 5 mins or so until she burped and then put her down (still asleep), used to work 9/10 otherwise she too would wake up with wind after 20 mins. When she got to 5 months, something clicked into place and now all that work has paid off (for now - fingers crossed it doesn't change!) We have a going to sleep routine that includes a feed but she's awake when I put her down and she sings/chatters to a teddy for 5/10 mins and then sleeps, normally for 2 hours+ From a google search.. Cecile 0506947938 or email to [email protected]. I don't know where she works sorry. I can't imagine how hard it could be with number 2 or 3 when I think about how much work it's taken with BF and sleep "training" to get to this point with DD!!

Thanks for your post Sunsa . I dont have anything personal going on with Cecile . You have plenty of opinions regarding her practice from this thread and go ahead with this .This is your choice . Good luck . <em>edited by salome on 22/06/2011</em>

Love your disclaimer :D and I'd definitely agree - I know I've hit jackpot when DS goes to sleep either without a murmur or with just a little friendly chat to his cot pals, and I know he's had a good rest when I find him sitting or standing in his cot with a big grin on his face rather than lying down, rubbing his face into the sheets trying to get back to sleep.

I think Sunsa has probably been scared off this thread by now and is probably more confused than ever about how often she should be feeding her baby, but looking at her OP, yes 2 of the daytime naps are very short, maybe tweaking the times would help make them longer and thus improve night sleep. When my DS would take very short naps, I found that if I anticipated his waking, I could be close by to quickly soothe him before he woke up completely and then he would go back to sleep for quite a long time. I think you know naps are at the right time when your baby goes down very easily, and you know they are long enough when your baby wakes up smiling*. *disclaimer, the happy nap rule is just based on my own baby and not to be interpreted as medical fact ;)

As I said, I guess things are different here in a mainly private healthcare environment. Not sure I'd compromise my own morals based on that, though. Or slate someone 'just because it's business'. Sunsa, have you tried getting her to have a longer nap first thing in the morning? I'm not sure a 20-minute nap really counts as a proper nap. At 7 months DS was having three naps a day - one in the morning not more than about an hour and a half after he woke up, one at lunchtime/early afternoon and one before dinner. His before-dinner one was about 45 minutes and the other two both an hour and a half. It wasn't till he started having all three that I realised the difference in him - he was a much happier little boy once he was getting enough sleep. But then, a friend's baby only ever slept about two hours in total during the day and that was all she needed. I guess they all have their own requirements and it's up to us to work them out! If she's well-rested during the day, though, perhaps she'll find it easier to sleep more at night and not wake up so much?

Dubaicat replied : They can. They could also extend professional courtesy as healthcare professionals. My mother is a teacher and would not dream of slating another teacher in such a public way. Congrats again on your ethics ! Sorry but courtesy between medical professionals in Dubai doesnt exist as healthcare is a bussiness unfortunatly .... <em>edited by salome on 21/06/2011</em>

Hi Sunsa, did any of this help answer your original question or are you currently looking it up elsewhere? babycentre.co.uk is a really good site that i use alot along with the Annnabel Karmel year planner. Good luck! X

They can. They could also extend professional courtesy as healthcare professionals. My mother is a teacher and would not dream of slating another teacher in such a public way.

DubaiCat replied : Thanks. Patients sharing opinions of doctors and other health professionals is a world away from health professionals sharing opinions of other health professionals. I guess things are different in a mainly private health environment such as here. Patients can be as well healthcare professionals !

Thanks. Patients sharing opinions of doctors and other health professionals is a world away from health professionals sharing opinions of other health professionals. I guess things are different in a mainly private health environment such as here.

The whole purpose of this forum is to be able to express our opinion regarding the subjects discussed (doctors specifically...), but congratulations on your ethics Dubaicat .

Nutty replied : Thanks for your advice Nutty but I worked ( I am myself an healthcare professional )with her a couple of years ago and was very disapointed ... I'd reconsider your description of yourself if I were you. Where I come from, 'professionals' don't slate other professionals in public.

Thanks for your advice Lemondrops . I am fine and not afraid at all of any discredit . Sorry but I cant give more details on this forum... On your side do you have anything more than : I also know of medical professionals who have worked with Cecile both inside and outside a particular private hospital in Dubai and have nothing but good things to say about her.

A friend of mine who regularly posts on EW once warned me of the dribble that comes from Salome. She was right!

Salome, do you have anything more than "maybe" and "other medical professionals"? If not, your post sounds more like the slanderous vitriol of a Sunday tabloid than that of a medical professional, JMO. IMO, that post does more to hurt and discredit you, than it does Cecile, and I would delete it. ETA I also know of medical professionals who have worked with Cecile both inside and outside a particular private hospital in Dubai and have nothing but good things to say about her. No one is saying you need to approve of her approach or philosophy but there is certainly no need to slander her in the manner you have. <em>edited by lemondrops on 21/06/2011</em>

pentel replied : It seems to me that salome has professional issues with Cecille and is trying to discredit her? I dont have any issues with her but I dont agree at all with the medical advices she gives . For your information I am not the only one ( as a healthcare professional ) how was very disapointed and unhappy working with her a few years ago in a private hospital in Dubai . This is maybe why she works for herself now ?! <em>edited by salome on 21/06/2011</em>

Thanks for your advice Nutty but I worked ( I am myself an healthcare professional )with her a couple of years ago and was very disapointed ...

Sounds like sour grapes!

It seems to me that salome has professional issues with Cecille and is trying to discredit her?

I agree with LD. I have seen Cecile also. Even though her methods did not work for me, I totally agreed with what she was saying and never did I think she was advising me to do something harmful to my children. I also think that she takes individual circumstances into consideration.